Ep. 56: Food Preservation for Beginners — How to Reduce Food Waste and Save Money

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (00:00.696)

Canning is one of those skills that sounds either deeply satisfying or mildly terrifying. If you’re interested in food preservation but worried about exploding jars, or worse, my guest today is here to tell you what you actually need to know to build a sustainable pantry.

Welcome to Sustainable in the Suburbs, a podcast for the eco-curious who want to live a greener life and are looking for a place to start. I’m your host, Sarah Robertson Barnes, a soccer mom with a station wagon and a passion for sustainable living.

Each week I’ll bring you practical tips and honest conversations to help you waste less, save money, and make small doable shifts that actually fit your real life. Because sustainable living doesn’t have to be perfect to matter, and you don’t have to do it all to make a difference. Hello, and welcome back to Sustainable in the Suburbs, the podcast where we start where we are, use what we have, and live a little greener, one small shift at a time. My name is Sarah, and I’m very excited to share this conversation with you today.

Before we get into today’s episode, just a reminder that Sustainable in the Suburbs is a bi-weekly show with new episodes coming out every other Tuesday. So make sure you’re following the show wherever you’re listening today so you don’t miss an episode. And if you’ve been enjoying the podcast, I would be so grateful if you left a rating or a review, shared an episode on social media, or clicked support the show in the show notes. Those small things really do help the show reach more people.

You can also head to sustainableinthsuburbs.com for all of the podcast episodes and show notes, plus the blog and everything else. We’re going to talk about food again today, because food is one of those things that touches almost every part of our daily lives. And because we have to feed ourselves every single day, it makes sense that convenience has become such a big part of how we shop and cook and eat. But so much of the modern food system is built around selling us.

Convenience. And of course, convenience makes sense. We are busy and tired and have to feed our families and pack lunches and all the snacks and getting dinner on the table alongside all of the other balls that we are juggling. So pre-made food and individually packaged snacks, ready to heat meals, they all solve a real problem in the moment. But they also come with trade-offs. They cost more, they have way more packaging.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (02:25.49)

And they make us dependent on a cycle of running back to the store. And all of that feels even harder when grocery prices keep going up with no signs of stopping. And over the past few years, I think a lot of us have also started to see just how fragile that system is with empty shelves and supply chain issues, rising food costs, tariffs, extreme weather, even just your regular life going off the rails for a week. It all makes you realize how much we rely on.

Being able to get exactly what we need, exactly when we need it. And this is where some of those old fashioned kitchen skills start to feel a lot less old fashioned and a lot more practical. This episode is not just about preserving food. It’s also about what happens when we know how to use what we already have. It’s about stretching your food budget and reducing waste and preserving the seasonal abundance of the summer, even if you don’t have a garden.

And building a kitchen that feels a little less chaotic when life gets unpredictable. And no, that does not mean you have to become a homesteader. It doesn’t mean making everything from scratch or canning hundreds of jars or never buying packaged food again. It just means learning a few useful skills one at a time so that when you do have too many tomatoes or a huge bag of apples or half a loaf of stale bread, a fridge full of odds and ends.

You have more options than either throwing the food away or running back to the store. My guest today is Kris Bordessa, someone who has been teaching these kinds of practical kitchen and self-reliant skills for years. Kris is the author of two books from National Geographic: the award-winning Attainable Sustainable, The Lost Art of Self-Reliant Living, and more recently, Attainable Sustainable Pantry. She is a longtime gardener and master food preserver.

Who encourages people to take small steps as they embrace legacy skills like growing food, home canning, cooking from scratch, and stocking a more useful pantry. What I love about Kris’s approach is that she is very clear that these skills are for everyone. It’s not about making everything from scratch or turning your kitchen into some trad wife aesthetic. It’s just about learning practical things that can help us waste less and spend less and feel more capable in our own kitchens. Here’s my conversation with

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (04:51.054)

Kris.

Hello, Kris. Welcome to Sustainable in the Suburbs. I’m so happy to finally have you here.

Kris Bordessa (04:59.532)

Hi Sarah. I’m happy to talk with you finally.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (05:02.134)

Yeah. We had a bit of technical difficulties, but we figured it out on both ends. And folks, if you’re not already following Kris on threads or on Facebook, go follow her immediately at Attainable Sustainable. You won’t regret it. She’s the best. but for listeners who are new to you, can you tell us a little bit about yourself and what Attainable Sustainable is all about?

Kris Bordessa (05:25.61)

Yeah. Attainable Sustainable came about. I I’ve been online with it since 2011. And the the coming about story for this is I mean, it’s kind of funny. We we were dealing with some you know, issues with potential barge interruptions back in two thousand eight, two thousand nine when we had a little bit of a recession going on. And I was talking with a friend of mine.

very, very smart woman, former RN, and we were talking about how are we going to you know make sure that we have the food that we need and we were talking about gardening and growing some of our own food as a you know fallback for that. That because I people who don’t know me, I I am in Hawaii, so we rely on on barges to bring in a lot of our supermarket food. so the conversation turned to how do we create some of that on our own and

In having this conversation it came about that she did not know that radishes grew in the ground.

And so I I thought, okay, I I might not be an expert, but man, I can help people grow radishes. I, you know, that it’s it’s such a it it was a very basic thing. You know, I I as far as what my knowledge is, my background is in you know, I grew up on a farm and we always always had our own garden. So I thought, gosh, I I can share this with people. So

Because my background is in publishing, my idea was was let’s write a book about it. And being in publishing, I knew that that that required having a platform. So I started my blog, started writing about it and and sharing information about gardening and and you know, crafting a pantry and cooking from scratch and all of those things. I did that in 2011 in

Kris Bordessa (07:29.792)

maybe twenty fourteen ish, I reached out to an agent and talked about this book project that I had because I thought I’ve, you know, I’ve got people following on social media and can we turn this into a book? And and she told me the market is saturated. It’ll never sell. Mm-hmm. so I, you know, walked away and thought, okay, fine.

If the market’s saturated for a book, I can still reach people online, which I was doing. so I continued doing that. I continued the blog. And in 2016, I had a phone call from National Geographic and they said, have you ever considered Have you ever considered writing a book? And I thought, well, yeah, actually I have. So anyway, that that’s how the whole attainable sustainable came about.

Yeah, is is you know, I’ve been online long before the books came about.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (08:27.328)

Yeah, just casual phone call from National Geographic.

Kris Bordessa (08:30.619)

You’re right. I know I I still kind of can’t believe it myself.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (08:35.511)

That’s wild. Yeah. I I love how when you talk about like these skills are for everyone. And why is that so important for you to say it like that?

Kris Bordessa (08:45.068)

I think they’re important skills. They’re, you know, I’ve kind of been calling them legacy skills. These are skills that our, you know, ancestors had and they know how to how how to, I don’t know, bake bread or roast a chicken or w you know, whatever the things are. We’ve gotten so far away from that with our, you know, current access to all of the fast food and all of the easy things and the drive-throughs. And I think that just teaching people that

I mean, I I’m not gonna say don’t ever go through a drive-thru. That that’s you know, that’s not reasonable. But if you’re at home and you’ve got s you know, a stocked pantry and some of this equipment and the ingredients you need, there’s there are some things that you can make at home without having to lean on that. And and you know, I think that’s important, especially with where our food system is right now.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (09:40.48)

Yeah. I I’ve noticed this. I know you’ve noticed this too, but why do you think folks are so interested in getting back to basics right now?

Kris Bordessa (09:48.726)

I think they’re worried. You know, I I I think we’re yeah I mean right now in the middle of this lettuce issue that’s happening and you know, people are concerned about the safety of their food. is it safe what we’re getting in the in the supermarkets? And the supermarkets are expensive right now. So I think they’re I think it’s a lot of things. you know, I think it’s the safety, I think it’s the the cost of food and figuring out that what

When you’re making it at home, it’s less expensive. There there’s really no way around that. I mean, depending on obviously if you’re you know, making a lobster, it’s not gonna be less expensive. But if you’re making basic food and and you learn a little bit about how to use those pantry ingredients, it’s less expensive to cook at home.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (10:34.958)

Yeah. My husband’s always saying this to me, that one of the ways that we can save money on food is by meal planning. He’s a spreadsheet guy. I’m a vibes person. So as someone who doesn’t like meal planning, something that I appreciate about you is the way that you frame, reframe the usual way that many of us think about meal planning. So I think that we either like start on Pinterest or whatever and we start with like a whole meal idea or recipe. And then we go to the store and we buy everything for that recipe.

And then we have all this left over. We don’t know what to do with. But you start with what do you have in your kitchen instead? So what do you mean by that necessarily? Like I don’t I look at my kitchen and sometimes I think, but we well, there’s nothing to eat. It’s full.

Kris Bordessa (11:17.902)

Okay, so yeah, I am really bad at meal planning. I mean, that’s just straight up. I am also a vibes person.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (11:24.983)

Okay. Vindicated.

Kris Bordessa (11:28.48)

And that’s probably part of why I do what I do and I’ve just learned to do it that way because you know, it’ll be four o’clock and I’ll say, it’s that time again. What are we gonna do? And, you know, I go to my pantry. I I live in a pretty rural area. I don’t have easy access to running down to the store or going to pick up fast food. That that’s not a common thing for us. So, you know, four o’clock comes around and I haven’t thought about what we’re having for dinner.

I’m gonna go to my pantry and I’m gonna go to my refrigerator and see what we have. so yeah, that’s that’s how I do things. And and by doing that, and I’m just kind of I just kind of come to the end of this. We we’re big on the whole leftover scene and what’s left in the refrigerator and how can we, you know, when there’s just a little bit of this and a little bit of that, and how can we use that instead of

tossing it out or, you know, helping turn that into a meal. So I just just have gone through kind of a a refrigerator clean out using those things. I made minestroni soup last night. you know, soup is a great way to to use those little bits and bobs that are in the fridge. So so yeah, I I don’t do a lot of meal planning. It’s very much what do we have access to.

What needs to be used up?

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (12:51.669)

How and how can I use this?

Kris Bordessa (12:52.718)

Yes. What what can be done with it?

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (12:57.132)

Yeah. What like s I just call it stuff in the fridge dinner. Like just have a little bit of everything. I think it’s called girl dinner on the internet sometimes. Just like just have bits and bobs for dinner. It’s right. It’s fine.

Kris Bordessa (13:07.948)

Yeah, and that’s it. As is we will we will try to use that up. And I mean I’ve got things like I say, soup is a good one, or we’ll do fried rice or or whatever, so that it’s just a way to use up those little bits. And then I also will freeze it. If I if I don’t think I’m gonna use it, I’ll toss it into a container and and then that goes in soup on

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (13:25.07)

Soup is always the end.

Kris Bordessa (13:27.286)

You know, waste nothing. Exactly.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (13:30.426)

So what kind of pantry staples would make that kind of flexible cooking easier to have on hand?

Kris Bordessa (13:37.89)

Hmm, I I mean the things that I keep are to me it seems very basic, but I guess for some people it’s not. What I keep on hand, I have dry beans always. The problem with dry beans is that they it does take a little bit of planning in advance because they need to be soaked and cooked. and because it takes some planning in advance, I also keep canned beans on hand. And if I haven’t thought ahead, I will, you know, fall back on that.

rice and grains, that sort of thing. broth is another one, whether that’s a store bought broth that you prefer to use, I make my own homemade broth because again it’s very inexpensive, a lot less expensive than buying it at the store.

What else?

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (14:29.282)

Those feel like the building blocks of so many meals and once you get good at cooking beans or grains, you’re kinda laughing. If you have them in the fridge or in the freezer or even from a can, you’ve got most of a meal right there.

Kris Bordessa (14:44.374)

Right. That that’s the basis of it. and then, you know, whether you’re a a meat eater or not a meat eater, you know, I tend to keep w we are a meat eating family and we tend to keep that in the freezer so that I can grab something out. Potatoes is another one. They don’t last forever, but I typically will have, you know, fresh potatoes, fresh onions, garlic, that sort of thing. And those all my husband has said he would eat potatoes every day of the year. So be you know.

So if we’ve got potatoes, you know, and then i i I do have the garden, so you know, I can go out and harvest a little bit out of the garden if I’m I’m having a good garden year, which I’m not this year. so all of those things just kind of come together. And it’s just a matter of learning, learning how to use those items. Oil is another one that you know, keep keeping a good oil on hand.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (15:39.97)

I found that once we started buying everything dry, so we have Bulk Barn here in Canada, which is it’s a nationwide store and it has everything in bulk, just like it sounds, you can bring your own containers. So we switched over to you know dry black beans, pinto beans, chickpeas, and dried rice and quinoa and all that kind of stuff. And then we got an instant pot and figured just figured it out. And now, like I said, my husband will soak the beans.

them in the instant pot and then we freeze them in those like silicone containers in a two cup ratio or whatever and that’s essentially a can of beans but we just do that every Sunday we’ll make a certain kind of bean or whatever and then the freezer is just stocked and it turns out it doesn’t actually take that much time. Because I think convenience is kind of the limiting factor here. So I think this also talks to the way that you talk about convenience because so much of the modern food system is built around selling us just that.

And of course, like that is really helpful, especially for busy households. I’m at soccer every single day of my life. but it also comes with trade-offs. So there’s, you know, the cost, the packaging, the waste and the quality, and just constantly being in purchase mode. So what are a few of these store bought items that are actually worth learning to make at home?

Kris Bordessa (16:58.526)

So my my go to answer for this is always going to be salad dressing. Salad dressing is I mean a and you can do it as simple as just a s a a basic vinaigrette, which is the you know, oil and vinegar and maybe a little bit of seasoning in there. Or you can make a creamy salad dressing. I have not bought store bought salad dressing in. I mean decades probably. we actually had a visitor, it’s it’s been a while now, but but

I was cooking dinner and he was sitting across the bar and talking to me while I was cooking and I was making my salad dressing and and he said, Kris, do you make homemade salad dressing? Is that all you I I said, Yeah, absolutely. I never buy salad dressing. And and for a number of reasons. Salad dressing is so expensive to buy. and the packaging, it kills me to just throw out bottle after bottle.

I am very aware of the plastic that we create. We do not have the ability to recycle plastic here on our island. so that just kills me to throw that away every time I finish a bottle of salad dressing. And you know what? It’s become the norm. If my husband is cooking dinner, he makes homemade salad dressing. My son has learned how to make an egg-based creamy salad dressing without measuring anything. You know, we all just kind of throw it together. We know how to do this because.

Because it’s been the norm for vibes, right? But it’s it’s it’s what we do. You know, nobody it I don’t think there’s a single maybe my maybe my second son. outside of him though, none of us would consider going to the store and buying salad dressing. It’s just not what we do. And that was breaking a habit, because I won’t you know, that has not always been the case.

We did used to buy salad dressing, but that’s been a matter of figuring out that, you know, it’s easy to make at home and I don’t want that plastic waste.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (18:58.86)

Yeah. I I honestly thought you were gonna say something like, you know, broth or beans or you know, ’cause that’s that’s where my mind was going. But you’re absolutely and I didn’t even think of salad dressing because we do the same thing. We just mix up the vinaigrette or the Caesar or whatever just as we’re cooking other things. but it was my husband who got me into that because I grew up in a salad dressing home with a you know the whole door of the fridge. Right. but and again, like it and it’s you never get through it. So you waste

what’s in the bottle as well as the bottle itself. Yeah. Yeah. We’re in we’re definitely in salad season right now. and because we’re recording this in August, I I also want to talk about what happens when there is suddenly more food than you can use right away. So for example, our CSA box and the backyard garden are both very overwhelming right now. and also my husband cannot control himself at the local farm store, which is great.

Kris Bordessa (19:31.042)

That’s true. Yeah.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (19:57.28)

you know, but I’m always saying, like, what’s our what’s our plan for this? Cause it can turn into food waste really quickly if we don’t have a plan for it. And I think a lot of people hear food preservation and immediately picture shelves and shelves of jars or learning how to pressure can. But let’s just dispel that for a moment and talk about how it can actually mean like much lower stake things, like freezing and dehydrating and

quick pickling or even in your book, there’s a great section on preserving in salt or oil, which I need to get back into doing. So before we talk about canning and we will walk us through some of those simpler preservation methods.

Kris Bordessa (20:37.512)

Yeah. I i it yeah, and you’re absolutely right. Even the refrigerator is considered e you know, you’re preserving food that, you know, isn’t gonna last on the counter, by putting it in the refrigerator. The freezer is is easy access. You know, like you’re talking about using it for freezing your beans and keeping those readily available and on hand. Same thing with i i if there’s a a little little bit of leftover green beans after cooking them, those can go in the

in the freezer as far as leftover things and ready to ready to use things. But then also, like you say, your CSA box or your garden, all of those things can be frozen. You know, you want to make sure that you’re you’re storing them in a way that they will last as long as they can in the freezer, whether that’s what are the seal a meal bags that people use or a good

You know, I freeze in glass. A lot of people have a problem freezing in glass because they’re concerned about breakage, but I haven’t had a problem with that. So I do freeze in glass sometimes. And it’s it doesn’t have as long a shelf life if it’s in the freezer because you’re gonna get the freezer burn and such. But but to extend a garden harvest and and not have to think about it, you know, the f the freezer is one of the easiest things. Everybody knows how to use a freezer. It there there’s there’s no extra knowledge that is required for for

utilizing that. quick pickling is another one. I I see so many people right now all over the internet saying, my gosh, I’ve got so many cucumbers. I’ve got so many green beans. The zu the zucchini. And and anything a cucum cucumber can do, a zucchini can do. If you you know you can the you can make pickles out of the zucchini as well as you can cucumbers.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (22:14.377)

Zucchini of it all.

Kris Bordessa (22:27.48)

So yeah, that’s another thing. If you can mix some vinegar and water and add a few spices, pour it over those fresh vegetables, whatever they are, carrots, you know, what have you, that’s an easy way to get that food preserved. And again, that, you know, it i it is gonna take freezer space, I’m sorry, refrigerator space, but it’s still, you know.

That cucumber would have lasted several days in the refrigerator, but as soon as you put it in a brine, you know, you’ve got months to eat that.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (23:00.768)

Yeah. Quick pickling was our gateway drug into panning. Yeah. I love dehydrating things as well. We found a dehydrator, like one of those like big like doomsday prepper ones, you know. on X caliber. Yes, it’s an X caliber. Yes, yes. we found it on Khajiji, which is like a Canadian Facebook marketplace, which we also have, but that’s what it is. and so I love dehydrating things into powders as well.

Kris Bordessa (23:04.085)

Yeah.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (23:27.692)

So I’ll if I have like a ton of I can only pickle so many jalapenos. So I’ll dry them, grind them into powder, onions, garlic, all of that kind of stuff. But fruit leather is something I’ve never tried. What should I know about fruit leather?

Kris Bordessa (23:42.286)

Fruit fruit leather is th the biggest problem with fruit leather is that if you’ve got kids they’re just gonna burn through it so quickly. That that was you know that was always the thing. It’s like can we maybe just just meet this out a little bit so that we’re not eating all of my work in one day? You know, if you need if you want something that’s, you know, like strawberries and bananas, maybe go have fresh strawberries and bananas now while they’re in season and then, you know.

Save that for another time. But kids, you know, kids kids just love the love the fruit roll. So that was always the biggest problem. but yeah, it’s easy. It’s easy to do. It’s time consuming, you know, ca because it does take

most of the day to get to to get those dehydrated.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (24:29.792)

I think I had a tomato paste incident, which is why I tried to I’ve been wanting to do fruit leather, but I don’t want to get burned like I did on the tomato paste, which took me I tried to do it in my oven. This was before I had a dehydrator. It took forever and I just said to myself, you know what, never again. That’s something that I just it’s fine to buy it in the can and then freeze the left.

Kris Bordessa (24:52.012)

That I I think I actually talk about that in my book. The tomato paste. That that is that is the one it when I ta when I talk about preserving things and and whether it’s freezing or however you’re gonna keep it, tomato paste is just I can go buy a nice sweet little can of organic tomato paste at the store and it’s it’s just not something that is worth my time. It’s you know, i if if the store’s closed and I never ever could get tomato paste again, it might be a different situation.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (24:54.977)

That you made okay.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (25:14.968)

Yeah it’s

Kris Bordessa (25:21.996)

You know, but i it’s it takes so long to cook it down and it takes so many tomatoes. It’s just not the thing that we use.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (25:31.343)

Amount of tomatoes. Right. Yes.

Kris Bordessa (25:34.222)

Yeah. You know, I would much rather and and where I’ve where I live I struggle with growing tomatoes, believe it or not. they are not an easy crop for me, so when I do get them, I would rather use them for making salsa or pizza sauce, which we use very regularly and you know, and and just if I do need tomato paste, I’ll get that at the store.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (25:56.43)

Sure. That’s that’s the know your limits thing and I think that’s that’s part of it too.

Kris Bordessa (26:01.068)

Right, right, right. You know, what what’s the what’s the return here? I’m gonna spend all you know, days cooking this stuff down and it’s it’s just

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (26:09.558)

I’m a big tomato pinners and I did it one year and I’ll never do it again. So it’s fine. Yeah. What’s a what would be a good you know, easy preservation project for beginners? Is your first time? Let me try something.

Kris Bordessa (26:14.136)

That’s that’s great.

Kris Bordessa (26:24.044)

When you’re are you talking about canning or just preserved?

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (26:26.408)

regular. We’ll we’ll get into the the high test canning situation in a second. But if you’re just, you know, you’re flipping through your book and you’re looking at these quick pickling or salt or oil, what would be a really good one to start with?

Kris Bordessa (26:38.83)

Quick quick pickling is a really easy one. as I as I said, just making that brine. The other one that that is pretty easy access is dehydrating herbs. If somebody’s got access to d you know, your fresh herbs, whether that’s a plant in the garden or

rather I don’t know where people get fresh herbs. Without buying them in this in the supermarket in the little market if somebody’s you know somebody’s selling. it’s easy. That that’s an easy one. It doesn’t take much in the way of prep work. I have an oregano plant. I just dried a whole bunch of oregano i in my car. Amazing. A hundred percent.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (27:04.654)

The farmer’s market.

Kris Bordessa (27:27.862)

I did I I thought, I don’t want to get out that dehydrator and it’s hot and I’ve got the car. And what would happen if I tried this? And I did try it and it worked beautifully. I I know I do I do weird things sometimes. I just spread it out on the, you know, I cleaned the leaves and and took them off the stems and spread that out on a cookie sheet that was covered with a towel and put it my car. And, you know, within a day it was Cars get hot. You know.

So within a day it was done. I didn’t have to think about it. Brilliant. The the only thing that happened is my husband kept getting in the car saying, What is going on in here?

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (28:03.534)

I don’t don’t worry about it. Just an air freshener.

Kris Bordessa (28:06.119)

Yeah.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (28:09.1)

Yeah, herbs are are a really easy entry point. And you have really great recipes in your book too for herb salts. Yeah. Which I’ve just recently gotten into. And now I like I made garlic scape salt. nice. which I’m obsessed with. I use a really like I don’t even want to use regular salt anymore. And I made basil salt. So those two really change the the profile of your food too. It makes you feel really fancy and you made that yourself.

Kris Bordessa (28:32.418)

Did you do did you use dry herbs for that or did you start with the fresh you did the fresh herbs and mixed?

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (28:38.004)

I did the fresh and the food processor and then I just used the dehydrating setting on my oven. Mm-hmm. And it only took like an hour and a half. So Yeah, nice. And I have enough to last me for the entire winter.

Kris Bordessa (28:49.006)

Yeah and and you can also skip the drying part for that and and if you just mix the the fresh herbs with salt and put them in the refrigerator, they will darken. but it’s again you can use that. I just I did a workshop at the local library showing people how to do that a couple of weeks ago. Yeah.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (29:07.894)

Yeah, that wouldn’t have occurred to me to put like a salt in the fridge. So Interesting. Yeah. All right, I’m gonna try that next ’cause I still have a lot of oregano. I didn’t realize that oregano would like take over the earth if you don’t continually cut it back.

Kris Bordessa (29:10.722)

Right. Yeah, and it stays.

Kris Bordessa (29:23.98)

Yeah. Yeah, it’s an aggressive one.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (29:27.02)

Yeah, I just recently learned that. So I never have to plant any more oregano ever again. Right. Right. Yeah. Okay, so let’s talk about canning. Yeah. I see you talk about canning a lot online. And this is why Kris is worth a follow because it is one of those skills that I think people are really curious about, but very nervous to try. So I hear that a lot, like, I don’t want to poison my family. No one does. So I think the internet makes that can make it harder, but also there’s a lot of advice out there that is not safe.

Kris Bordessa (29:34.733)

Okay.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (29:56.866)

Right. And you have a real expertise in this area. So I’d love to talk about how people can approach canning with confidence, but also respect for the process. so for someone who is brand new to canning, what do they need to understand before they start?

Kris Bordessa (30:13.196)

Well, first I wanna say if you’ve got people out there who are nervous about canning, I think that’s good. Because they’re they’re paying attention to the fact that this is something that requires a little bit of care. it’s the people who aren’t afraid that worry me. Be you know, I I j had a long conversation with a lot of people yesterday online and the idea that people can just put

something in a jar and if it seals, it’s fine. It you know, you you could put leftovers in a jar and put them in the refrigerator and they’re going to seal. It’s just the heat is going to draw that seal down and it’s going to look sealed. It is not preserved. so there are a lot of people who just think you can do that and that is not so. there there’s a real science behind canning.

And and I’ll come come right up to and say I’m not a scientist. I I am just somebody who I I’ve you know gone through the Master Food Preserver program. I you know, I understand the perils of canning and what can happen. so so that’s my background and and why I I try really hard not to be, you know, like aggressive about it because there are some people who are super, super aggressive, like, you know, you can’t do that. And I mean

You can, but I suggest you don’t. And you know, there are some people who are totally open to hearing, hearing that, and others who are like, nah, forget it. I’m, you know, this is the way my grandma has done it, and it doesn’t matter if it’s, you know, if it’s a risky thing. And and those people tend to not want to hear anything more about it. So I I mostly try to focus on people who are new, people who want to learn the proper way to can.

And teach them, you know, that there are specific rules to follow and and guide them because those are the people who want to learn how to do it and want to want to pack their pantry with good food. to answer your question, what do people need to know? I think the biggest thing is is the need to know that there are there are rules, there are guidelines, and and these things have been tested by you know USDA scientists, and we know this. We know how to safely

Kris Bordessa (32:38.424)

preserved food in jars. so so following those rules, you need to know that there are, as you say, some scary people out there on the internet providing some not very trustworthy suggestions. So know where your where your recipe comes from. Know know where you can find the good resources and who those are. I have a there’s a page on my website if people want to go to my website and search for resources, it’ll come right up that

that I talk about that, how to how to know who to trust, because that’s the other thing, right? There’s everybody’s on the internet. A anybody can say anything on the internet, but there are certain people that you can trust for that.

And then I think probably the next thing to note would be that there are two two different ways to preserve food in jars, depending on what you’re canning. The acidic foods, like jam and jelly and fruits, pickles, if people want to can pickles and not do just refrigerator pickles. acidic foods can be processed in a water bath canner.

Which is basically just putting filled jars underwater and boiling them for a certain amount of time. A specific amount of time, not just like randomly. Follow the recipe. The second type of canning is pressure canning. And that pressure canning does require a special pot, special canner. You cannot just use an instant pot for that.

It needs to be a an actual pressure canner, not a pressure cooker. And that is what you would use for doing low acid foods. That’s if you want to can meat or fish or broth or vegetables that have not been pickled.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (34:34.094)

So, but I do water bath canning and it is just basically like a big stock pot. Right. That’s fine. But we have not delved into pressure canning yet. We did buy a pressure canner, but we have an induction stove and it wouldn’t work on that. But for our water bath canning, we have like big outdoor burners because we do about a hundred liters of passata, just pressed tomatoes every year. My husband, again, he’s a Facebook marketplace wizard, found a tomato mill. nice. from a neighbor.

Whose grandfather had just died and they used to do like garage saucing. So now we do garage saucing. but we learned the hard way how long tomatoes take to process. The first time we did it, we started at about 10 PM. Yep. And we we we were up till three o’clock in the morning because it takes 70 minutes or whatever it is. I can’t remember from our recipe, but we didn’t know that. We thought it took 10 minutes like dilly beans. Right. Yeah.

Kris Bordessa (35:17.296)

gosh.

Kris Bordessa (35:29.09)

Nope. Yeah. Every everything that you do has got a different amount of processing time required. And and that’s you know, it goes back to know your resource, find a trusted recipe and and then follow those instructions.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (35:44.088)

There’s a little section in your book about making adjustments to recipes. and that’s what I I I do have a qu a specific question about that, but where can people have some wiggle room and where should they absolutely not get creative with the recipe?

Kris Bordessa (36:00.374)

There there is there is a little bit of wiggle room in some of these things. just as a for instance, using different spices. You can safely add dry spices, not fresh herbs. But you’re you know, if you’ve got some dried oregano that you have done in your car, you could be adding that to your tomatoes or or what have you. You can safely add that. you can the you know, you can use

Lemon juice or lime juice.

Bottled you know, you wanna make sure that it’s a bottled bottled lemon juice or lime juice.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (36:39.598)

Why does it need to be bottled? Is it ’cause it’s like a consistent acidity versus

Kris Bordessa (36:43.134)

It’s consistent acidity. Yeah. Yeah. We want to make sure that it’s that it is the acidity that the USDA used for testing those recipes.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (36:55.992)

I think the thing that I was thinking of was switching out hot peppers. So like if you want to use, you know, a green chili versus a red chili, depending on your heat, that kind of thing. Yep. Okay.

Kris Bordessa (37:05.358)

Absolutely. Peppers, you you want to maintain the volume, whatever whatever the called for volume is, and and then outside of that, all peppers are completely interchangeable in canning. So yeah. If you like a hot spicy salsa, you know, ditch the the sweet banana peppers and go straight for palpaniros. Okay.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (37:25.006)

So my question though is about garlic. Can I add more garlic to things? Because I really like the garlic that comes out of our pickled jalapenos, but I don’t care for the jalapenos as much. So can I load in more garlic or would that be a no no?

Kris Bordessa (37:40.654)

You’re talking about fresh car.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (37:42.338)

Yes.

Kris Bordessa (37:43.724)

And it’s pickled.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (37:45.262)

Yeah, so but you just you know, if our pickled jalapeno recipe calls for like two cloves of garlic and you slice it up and you put it in, can I put in like five or should I just

Kris Bordessa (37:56.815)

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Now I gotta I gotta think about that because you’re pick you’re pickling them. I’m trying to think.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (37:57.539)

Yeah, yeah

Kris Bordessa (38:06.232)

I mean I th I I’m gonna have to go I ha I ha have to go look and see. I have to go look about that because I think that if you’re making like a s like a spaghetti sauce, say, and it and it calls for fresh garlic and you mix it in there, you don’t wanna add fresh garlic. You don’t wanna you don’t double the garlic or add more. You you could add dried garlic powder if you wanted it to be more garlicky. My what we where you’ve got me thinking is I I’m pretty sure that you can pickle garlic safely. So in other words

That’s what you’d be doing. Okay.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (38:38.902)

Yeah, I might have to look around for some more different recipes. I just like that it’s like jalapeno pickled. Right. Right. So I’ve

Kris Bordessa (38:46.19)

I’m gonna I’m gonna do some digging for you.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (38:48.246)

Okay. I guess the other thing I could do is once the jar is open and we put it in the fridge, I could just slice more garlic into it then. And let it like quick pick. Okay, that’s gonna be my happy medium. I’m not gonna mess around with the recipe.

Kris Bordessa (38:55.243)

Absolutely.

Kris Bordessa (39:01.038)

Yeah. Okay. absolutely.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (39:03.126)

Yeah. That’s just what I wanted to know because that’s one of my favorites. But when I was reading that section of your book, I was like, maybe I should ’cause my plan was I’m gonna add a ton more garlic this year. And then I was reading that section like, Mm, I’m gonna ask her.

Kris Bordessa (39:15.851)

Right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. So so yeah, I’m sorry I don’t have a a specific answer for you.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (39:20.502)

Yeah, no, I think I’m just gonna add more and do a quick pickle once it’s in the fridge and then we have a happy medium. So I’ve been cleaning for years and I still didn’t realize that. So it’s all there’s always something more to learn.

Kris Bordessa (39:33.1)

Of absolutely. Yeah. A and the science changes too as they as they are, you know, digging in and finding, you know, different things. Th there’s a lot of talk in the canning world right now.

Kris Bordessa (39:49.886)

You know, it’s it’s it’s a little scuttle butt. the the folks at ball who do recipe development, they’re the people who make the canning jars that we all use. they did some testing a couple years ago now on apples. And what they found is that going forward they will be acidifying all of their apple products because the apples that we’re getting in the stores now tend to be sweeter, they’ve been bred to be sweeter.

They’re not as tangy, they don’t have as much acid in them. So they have decided in their books and in their recipes that they will be acidifying the apples. Now that’s them. And and ball is is a trustworthy source. The National Center for Home Food Preservation has not yet adopted that rule. I I guess they haven’t seen anything that makes them think that that’s necessary. So there’s a little bit of

You know, Isball being over cautious, maybe, but the National Center is not i is not yet embracing that suggestion. So things change, right? And and that’s that’s why, you know, th they say to make sure that you’re you know the resources that you’re using are, you know, new. You’re you’re not using grandma’s you know, canning book from nineteen forty two, ’cause things have changed.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (41:06.392)

To be

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (41:12.408)

Sure. Yeah. I mean, we even still have some of our grandmother’s old canning jars that had the glass lids. nice. Not the new snap lids, which we also didn’t realize we had to replace every single time that we can. We learned that very quickly. but one of my favorite things about canning, honestly, is when you’re done and it’s all on the shelf, and I can just go into my cold cellar when I’m making dinner and say, like, okay, so I need tomatoes and I need this and I need that, and I can take it upstairs. I feel

Kris Bordessa (41:30.413)

Yes.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (41:41.43)

really accomplished. And I feel like I yeah, I did that. I feel it just makes me feel I’m just even struggling to find the word. Like I just so self-reliant and capable. And I think that’s really important right now too. Like I want to end about talking about preparedness like this. We joked about the doomsday prepper dehydrator because one of those deeper ideas in your work is that stocking a pantry and knowing how to use it is not just for hardcore preppers.

And I think these past few years of turmoil have made us realize that grocery shopping is not just a habit. It’s a whole system that we’re depending on. And the disruptions don’t have to be dramatic, but there’s also storms and power outages and tariffs and job loss and just supply chain issues, all the chaos that we’re dealing with. And just an impossible week, even can make it fall apart in your house, your routines. So what does that practice?

practical preparedness look like in just an ordinary suburban household?

Kris Bordessa (42:43.584)

Well, I I mean I absolutely agree with you and this is what I’ve been saying for years, is that you know, the doomsday preppers are out there waiting for the zombies, you know, or or whatever whatever they’re doing. And and the more likely scenario is that, you know, as you say, some there’s gonna be a job loss or there’s going to be a reduction in income.

for us in in Hawaii we are you know, we had in two thousand six we had a a big earthquake that impacted the docks and we could not the barges could not come in. And at any given point they say we’ve got four days worth of food here on the islands and in the grocery stores, which is crazy to me. so ev you know, and and I think that every region ha you know, other regions have tornadoes or or you know, we we just we’re winter, right. I mean we just never know.

what’s going to happen. So absolutely having you know, maintaining a pantry where you can go in and even if it’s not homemade, you know, if you if you don’t have any inclination whatsoever to can local tomatoes, not a problem. Go to the grocery store and buy canned tomatoes. But having those there

you know, it it’s gonna allow you to get out there and and do some home cooking. If you can’t get to the grocery store or, you know, your budget has suddenly been slashed, you’ve got some of that to lean on. and it’s also I mean the other thing that I think about too is that that when we have issues as I say, we have hurricanes here and w you know, all the people at the grocery store lining up to buy the food. I’m not in that line.

You know, so I’m not adding to that chaos. that that’s another benefit for me is is that you know, I can go, okay, I I don’t I don’t need to have a shopping cart full of food that I’m gonna go get now because I’ve got a pantry that’s stocked and I can I can Right. Yeah, I mean I I’m I will maybe go for chocolate bars. but

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (44:46.05)

That panic doesn’t hit us hard. Yeah.

Kris Bordessa (44:56.512)

Outside of that, yeah, there there’s just not that that huge sense of panic. Like I can I can do a week without having to go to the grocery store. I’m not, you know, totally dependent upon that. So yeah, I I think that having having that i and and adding to it, even if it’s just a little at a time, that’s always the big thing that people talk about is the budget, right? Well, how do I go stock a pantry? I didn’t do it all at once. I didn’t go

you know, buy a thousand dollars worth of food and bring it home and put it in the pantry. It’s just a little here and a little there. If I’m gonna buy a can of beans, I’m gonna buy two. You know, so that I’ve got an extra. And and I just don’t let those run out so that there’s always something to fall back on.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (45:43.672)

Just making sure that you have enough.

Kris Bordessa (45:46.466)

Right. A enough and then some. You know, so so that if there’s and enough for now and then and then yeah, if something happens I you know, I have access to that as well.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (45:55.928)

Right. It doesn’t have to take up your whole basement. It just has to be well planned.

Kris Bordessa (46:01.228)

I don’t even know if I’d say I’m well planned.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (46:06.87)

We’ll show you the inside of my cold color. So there you go.

Kris Bordessa (46:09.107)

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (46:12.186)

I’d also like to make sure that we end on community because you talk about that a lot too. And I love that because self-reliance can sound very individualistic. Like the goal is to need nobody, but I think that so many of these skills are rooted in sharing, in sharing, you know, our knowledge and our recipes and our tools and our experience. So how do we keep community in the picture when we talk about self-reliance and preparedness like this?

Kris Bordessa (46:38.986)

Yes. self I mean self reliance sounds so much like I you know, I’ve got me and I’m covered and that’s the end of it. And and that’s not that’s not what I’m about. That’s not what I’m suggesting at all. I think that we need to take care of each other. I think we need to be you know, as I say, if I’ve got a pantry full of food and my neighbor down the street didn’t get a chance to go to the grocery store and they’re hungry, I can share. you know, I I’ve got enough to share or I can make a meal and invite them to join us.

so there’s that piece of it that if I’ve got if I’ve got a nicely stocked pantry, I I can help share that in the community. we do a lot of there’s a little bit of a topic drift, but we do gleaning here, but we have a lot of fruit trees and such that you know that will come down and that also goes to the to the food local food pantry so that that gets into the system so we’re we’re not wasting that.

But yeah, I I do a lot of a lot of education online. I have my website with with recipes and such and I you know, I talk about about this a lot online. I’ve got the books, but I’m also doing things in person. I I’ve I’ve started

especially in the past couple of years when we’ve kind of hit this, as you say, turmoil. I have been being more focused on helping other people learn how to do things. And and for me that’s like I guess I said I did the the workshop at the library. Mm, not a lot of opportunities to do big classes here, but I’ve been been inviting friends to my house where I’ve I had one gal actu actually several

over the course of time, interested in learning how to make jam. And and we’ve got a lot of fresh fruit here. So, you know, c come over. I I’ve got jam to make. Come watch me. Just having that that kind of hands-on opportunity to see it happen from start to finish seems to help people and give them the confidence to do it at home. So I’m doing that sort of thing, sharing that with people.

Kris Bordessa (48:52.278)

And then I’ve been I’ve got a group of three or four I had a a young man actually who is in my son’s band, he approached me and he said, Would you ever think about doing a class on fermentation? And I said, Yeah, you know, and you know, to to have this guy, you know, come to me and ask me, I said, Absolutely. I said, You set it up and and and we’ll we’ll make it happen. So we did. So it ended up being a group of four or five of us. And

Everybody brought something different and they all just sat and chopped and poured and mixed and a asked questions. my gosh. And you know, talked and and and came up with questions that I would not have thought of answering you know, until until they they they asked the just these great questions. so that’s been good. And you know, that’s food. But there are other things too, is it I want

People who have skills, even if it’s so many times people think they don’t have skills, we need to be sharing that. You know, are you a quilter? Is that a skill you have? Go teach somebody how to quilt or to sew a button on. Or, you know, any of these things that are just basic, basic skills. Basically, doing something for yourself instead of trusting or having to call the you know, the tailor or the plumber or what have you.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (50:14.954)

Just buy something new and just

Kris Bordessa (50:16.76)

Exactly. Yeah, exactly. So I think that

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (50:19.198)

is such an underrated skill, even if it looks terrible. Right. Just fix it.

Kris Bordessa (50:24.312)

Just fix it so that it’s usable. And you know, I tend to be just like with my food and my refrigerator, I tend to be a person who is very much like, we have a problem. What do we have here so that I can fix it? Yep. And I and I’ve come to understand that that’s not how a lot of people operate. But for me that that’s, you know, how can I make this what do I have that could fix this problem? so and that comes with having skills. I think that comes with having, you know, grown up the way I grew up, but that’s

how my family did it. but yeah, very much, very much doing things with other people and sharing the skills that you have. I mean, even if it’s just making a spaghetti sauce, you know, teach your kids. If if you’re sending your kids out into the world knowing how to cook their own food, that’s a gift.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (51:13.804)

Yeah, I agree. I’m working on it. Yeah, I’ve got two teen sons right now and they’re g starting to get really interested in cooking. Good. And I couldn’t be happier. You know, my my son’s into the smoker right now. I don’t I don’t eat meat. I don’t know what’s going on over there, but he’s he’s really locked in on it. And it’s interesting to see like that he’s he became curious and he wanted to teach himself how to do it and he’s been, you know.

Kris Bordessa (51:16.27)

No doubt.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (51:40.118)

watching the videos and all that kind of stuff. And I just think that’s so wonderful. So that’s something that I see you doing every day is in sparking that curiosity for folks to to try these things. And so yeah, Kris, this has been so helpful. Thank you so much for coming on today. Of course.

Kris Bordessa (51:56.334)

Absolutely. Absolutely. And and yeah, I I’m I’m out on the internet, I’m on Facebook, I’m I’m on all the things. And if people have got questions, I I encourage them to ask.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (52:07.79)

Yeah, for sure. And before we wrap up, can you let people know where to find you and where they can get their copy of Attainable Sustainable Pantry?

Kris Bordessa (52:16.062)

Mm, attainable Sustainable Pantry is going to be available at any bookstore. they may have to order it in for you. if anybody wants to order online, I always recommend Bookshop. For sure. Okay. and then where I am online I’m at attainable sustainable dot com. I have a a newsletter people can subscribe to. I have a new ish online community that people can join and

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (52:27.406)

Yep, I’ll drop the bookshop link for that.

Kris Bordessa (52:45.08)

gather with like minded folks. So yeah, I’m I’m online. They they’ll find me.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (52:50.498)

They will folks find her. She’s amazing. Thank you so much, Kris. This has been

Kris Bordessa (52:54.591)

This has been fun. Fantastic. It’s been fun. Thank you.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (53:00.236)

So glad that I got to talk to Kris today. I love her so much online and I just love how she makes us feel that something can feel so big and overwhelming, can feel much more doable. So we don’t need to overhaul our entire pantries or start canning everything or bake all our own bread or make everything from scratch. But we can start paying closer attention to what we already have. So your one small shift this week is to start in your kitchen before you go to the grocery store. Look in your fridge.

your freezer and your pantry and choose one or two things that need to be used, whether it’s your leftover rice or some sad looking vegetables or some fruit that needs to be stewed, something you bought with good intentions and then forgot about. So before you add more food to your house, just see what you can make from what’s already there. Just one meal, because that’s where a more useful pantry really starts. Not with buying a new bunch of jars or stocking up on things that you don’t really know how to use, just using what you have and building from there.

For more tips on building a sustainable kitchen, be sure to check out her book, Attainable Sustainable. And you can also head to sustainableinthesuburbs.com slash blog, where I have lots of blog posts on how you can get creative on using what you already have in your kitchen. Thank you so much for listening today. Until next time, start where you are, use what you have, and live a little greener.

Sarah Robertson-Barnes (54:25.442)

Thanks for tuning in to Sustainable in the Suburbs. Every small step adds up, and I’m so glad we’re doing this together. If you enjoyed this episode, please make sure to follow the show, share it with a friend, and leave a review wherever you get your podcasts. You can find me at sustainableinthesuburbs.com or at Sarah Robertson Barnes on all the things. Until next time, start where you are, use what you have, and live a little greener. This podcast is produced, mixed, and edited by Cardinal Studio.

For more information about how to start your own podcast, please visit http://www.cardinalstudio.co or email Mike at mike at cardinalstudio.co. You can also find the details in the show notes.